cessna: Good evening Regrowth
cessna: I have enjoyed your website for quite some time, and thank you for the service.
mike29: Greetings and salutations! Did I miss the Dr.?
cessna: Anybody having any luck with 5% Minox?
Regrowth: no the dr. isn’t coming for another 20 minutes or so
Regrowth: you guys are just eager beavers 🙂
mike29: Hi John, yesterdays Dr. P chat log wasn’t listed. It has you and Dr. Lee.
mike29: Yes, me and my twin are eagerly awaiting. 🙂
Regrowth: I know I haven’t adde din dr. p’s chat yet
Regrowth: gotta do some work… be back in a few minutes… the madness never stops! 🙂
cessna: hum dee dum dee dum….
mike29: so does anyone have any bad hair day jokes?
cessna: 15 minutes ’til it’s time to play the feud
cessna: As in the gameshow, “let’s play the feud.”
cessna: So, aside from the reason we are all here, how’s everyone doing today
mike29: since we’re talking about cloning… wouldn’t the game be double jeopardy?
cessna: yeah, or maybe the $50,000 question 🙂
mike29: i know.. bad pun. my sense of humor is only as sharp as my hairline.
The_Lone_Raider: hi all
cessna: Hello Lone Raider…
mike29: John Tesh is on Fox News. Is that his real hair?
arbor69: hi all
The_Lone_Raider: hi arbor
cessna: mike29: NO! I know because he was in my fraternity…old photos show him essentially bald
arbor69: hey lone
arbor69: well it looks good
mike29: still looks good though.
The_Lone_Raider: does it?
cessna: Could be a good xplant
mike29: the go-tee helps him
The_Lone_Raider: i am to assume that all here have hairloss problems?
mike29: he looks human.
arbor69: curious what the doc has to say
arbor69: to some degree
cessna: to some degree here too, doing everything I can though
arbor69: hi spam
The_Lone_Raider: is everyone here male?
arbor69: I am switching to 5%
Mike: whats happenin all
Spam: ive been on 5%+Retin A for 6 months
Tremor: I just bought it
mike29: Hi Mike. fellow clone
Spam: and proscar1.25 mg
Mike: to bad it wasnt hair!
Spam: hasnt done anything but accelerate lose
cessna: I have had a period of shedding since changing from 2% to 5%, anyone similar?
arbor69: spam is that in combonation
Spam: im frustrated
Mike: sounds rough
Tremor: that’ the only reason I haven’t used it yet, the shedding…geez
Mike: yeah.. that sounds like a big problem
arbor69: shedding but it comes back?
cessna: yeah but you have to figure that hair was on its way out anyway, and pray that it comes back
Mike: they say its a part of the process but I dont find that much help
arbor69: so confusing
cessna: I’ve just now stopped shedding mostly…so I guess we’ll see what happens over the next few weeks
mike29: one thing I noticed about the shedding is that many of the proscar users were also using retin A…
The_Lone_Raider: how long did the shedding last?
mike29: do you think the shedding could also be from using too much retin A from overdoing it?
cessna: retin-a burned the $%!( out of my head
Spam: my shedding has stopped
Spam: but I have no regrowth i guess
Spam: it just keeps gettin thinner and thinner
Mike: it may take some time
Mike: so they say
Spam: been 6 mos.
arbor69: where’s the doc
cessna: shedding for me set in after the first week of use, and went on for about 3 weeks
Tremor: what about that stuff from Lewbosky or whatever, the 2% minox + retin-A…anyone with info on that?
Mike: are you using minox spam?
mike29: been 2 months. no shedding and regrowth is starting.
The_Lone_Raider: would like to stay but i have to go 🙁
Mike: whats your hairline like mike?
mike29: Lewenberg is the “hair-antichrist”
Tremor: what? why’s that?
mike29: diffuse thinning for about 4 yrs. hairline is still there.. just thin
Mike: yeah sounds exactly like me
Mike: diffuse thinning
Spam: me too
Tremor: oh…so you used that stuff then?
cessna: me too
Mike: do yo ustill have a frontal hairline
Spam: getting werse by the day tho
mike29: Lewenberg is out to scare everyone with half truths about proscar and 5%.
cessna: anyone still using folligen
arbor69: I am 29, and just want a little more back, not too much to ask for right?
Tremor: well…then it seems already that all the topical stuff sucks, right?
mike29: just turned 29 yesterday
Mike: for those of you that are diffuse thinners do you still have a frontal hairline?
Tremor: hey, I’m just 27…
Mike: im 23 damnit!
arbor69: a diffuse one
cessna: I’m 25 …
arbor69: where is the doc?
Mike: young men we all are!
Mike: its such a discracefull thing
arbor69: so it seems
mike29: the weird part is that some hair is growing below the hairline anout a quarter of an inch.
cessna: Time to go fetch a cocktail…be back in short order
Tremor: well…geez…then what’s left? if all topical solutions don’t work effectively, what does that leave?
Mike: I keep saying that i should start treatment soon
arbor69: time to buzz the head
mike29: what left? bald chicks?…?
Mike: yep thats what my brow does
arbor69: mine to
Mike: bald chicks that would be interesting
Tremor: nah, I don’t have the head shape for buzzing it off
Mike: yeah hes been shavin for years
Regrowth: hey everybody check out the new transplant site design and let me know what you think
Mike: im not sure I could get away with it tho
cessna: the thing is, if your hair has stopped growing in some places like mine, shaving is a big risk because it may never grow back
Mike: thats true also
Tremor: well, that makes me bring it up again…transplants worth the effort ya think? or am I just getting snowed as usual?
Mike: its a matter of can you live with your hair_loss_ie looking at it every day
arbor69: depends on what your expectations are
Regrowth: agreed arbor69… also how much your finances can afford
Mike: yep they can cost some big $$$
cessna: I dunno, I have seen so many bad transplant jobs that it makes me wary… sometimes the results are simply ludicrous
arbor69: but some look good
Tremor: well…obviously it’s finance related…but aside from that…does it work consistently enough to pursue it?
Mike: make sure you get a good doctor
Regrowth: yeah if you go to the right doc
Mike: cause they shure can look like shit
arbor69: how do you find a good one?
Tremor: ok, so what’s the deal on Bosley? on the one hand they’re the most prominent, on the other hand they got sued that one time…
cessna: true, that’s why it pays to research it highly before you go, it could be the best thing or you could wind up butchered.
Regrowth: go to one’s with good reputations
arbor69: yeah whats up w/bosley
Tremor: I’ve got one of those “free consultations” on Saturday with BMG, so I’m just asking
Regrowth: i’m sure dr. cooley can address that when he gets here (transplant questions)
mike29: law suit dont mean much.. remember McDonalds got sued for spilled coffee. A lot of sue happy losers out there
Mike: that fleming myer cap thingy looks pretty interesting
cessna: there’s not a doctor around that hasn’t been sued at one point or another…most have dozens on their wrap sheet. Believe me, I’m an attorney
Tremor: yeah, but it could me alot also…I’d like to see *that* guy’s before and after pics
Mike: flap i mean
Tremor: er, it could “mean” a lot also I meant
Regrowth: true mike… cessna, i’ve seen plenty of docs who’ve never been sued and don’t have any problems with the better business bureau
mike29: I just waiting for the first loser to sue merck for Propecia. probably for excessive hair growth on face. grin
Mike: yeah or his balls fell off
Regrowth: there’s already a woman doing that against upjohn
Mike: or he shot fiery hot sperm
cessna: Yes, but the BBB is not a good barometer for satisfaction all in all.
Regrowth: facial growth.. not her balls falling off
Regrowth: it’s one factor… if someone has a ton of complaints against them, you know something’s up
Mike: thats a good thing
Tremor: I hear it’s like a 3 grand minamum for the BMG procedure…
Regrowth: just about anyplace you go will be 2-3 grand minimum
arbor69: what is bmg
Tremor: er, minimum…something like that
arbor69: transplant place?
Tremor: yeah, Bosley
Regrowth: for one procedure… 2-3 will be required for anything decent
arbor69: what is the flap mke
Regrowth: if you wanna find out what the flap is, go to the transplant site and check out the flap information
mike29: but still I wasn’t impressed with Bosley’s commercials. It seemed too optimistic
cessna: Yes, but believe me when I say that essentially all physicians have had legal issues at some point, whether warranted or not. There’s those that have, and those that will. I wouldn’t necessarily dismiss a physician from consideration just because he has been involved in litigation
Tremor: well…I don’t have any bald “spot”, just getting a little thin on top overall, so I don’t know how that’s gonna affect cost…
Regrowth: i’ve heard bosley is decent-good with results but overpriced
Regrowth: that’s true cessna… anybody can be sued whether they are guilty of anything or not
arbor69: our doc is late
Tremor: well, then who else is a good transplant place? they’re kinda hard to find, even on the net
Spam: yo…im 21 and i just wanted to keep what i had
Spam: no such luck with Dr. Lee’s program
Spam: 6 months now
cessna: Spam, hit the available treatments RIGHT NOW
Spam: ive seen it all
arbor69: but I willnot wear a rug
mike29: hey john, any word on when the gene doc will do the interview?
Spam: getting 5% rogaine tomorrow
Regrowth: before you can decide that you’d have to decide whether you’d want only transplants or whether you’d consider other procedures like reductions, etc
cessna: arbor69: mucho applause
Regrowth: thursday or friday
Spam: cuz i dont really fully trust dr. lee’s product’s effectiveness
Spam: im so pissed
Regrowth: on the phone with dr. cooley now
arbor69: your web site tells some grusome stories about reductions
Tremor: no, no reductions if I can help it, I don’t see how slicing up the scalp is gonna help, how can hair grow through scar tissue anyway?
arbor69: i agree
mike29: Starting using Nano shampoo. any reason why not to use it everyday cept for cost?
arbor69: scary procedure to me
Spam: i think proscar worked in reverse for me
Spam: im gonna stick with it for 6 more months
Tremor: pro-scar…think about it
mike29: like con-gress?
Spam: because i dont know what else to do
cessna: For me, proscar has been somewhat effective, and innocuous as far as side-effects
Regrowth: really? I don’t recall any about reductions…
Spam: i take supplements
Spam: and minox
mike29: same as cessna here
Spam: what else can i do?
Regrowth: reductions are about your only way to get really good transplant results if you have extensive baldness
arbor69: finasteride has worked for me, it seems to help keep what you have
Spam: not for me
Regrowth: how long have you been on it spam?
Spam: thats all that i wanted when i started
cessna: spam how long have you been on the treatments
Spam: about 5-6 months
Tremor: well, I don’t have extensive baldness now, but what if I get some grafts put it now to thicken things up, and then later the other hair falls out and I’d need a reduction? then I’m screwed for real!
mike29: ive got a lot of tiny hairs pooping up in the hair line
cessna: give it some more time!
Spam: i have the vellous hairs on the hairline
Spam: but my density up top has gotten so much worse
Spam: more time….
Spam: its so hard
Regrowth: it gets worse before better spam
mike29: vellous mixed with terminal here
Spam: i know
Spam: but its been a long time already
Spam: now im getting a lot of vellous fallout
Regrowth: arbor, a good doc will plan for future loss and save hair so that if it worsens later he can do further transplantation that’ll look natural
Spam: not much terminal fallout, but my hair looks worse every day
Mike: spam would you attribute this to the start of your treatment?
Spam: i have no idea
mike29: spam the fallout is normal the hair gets thicker with successive crops.
cessna: spam just don’t let it affect the other things in your life… if respond, it will take care of itself and nothing you can do by worrying – except lose more
Regrowth: are you using just propecia spam or that and minoxidil?
Spam: i use Dr.Lee’s minox and 1.25 proscar religiously daily
Spam: and retin-a
arbor69: is the doc on the way
Regrowth: that’s what I use and it’s worked great for me… so have hope 🙂
Regrowth: yeah he had problems logging in so he’s trying again now
Chance Goodman: Has anyone had good results with rogaine 5%
mike29: Dr Lee’s full treatment with Nono shampoo. John how often did you use Nano shampoo?
arbor69: what is the idea behind this cloning idea
Spam: im 21 years old!! in college!! how can i NOT worry about it?
Tremor: wait, is Dr. Lee the same as Dr. Lewenberg? I’m getting confused
cessna: I am hopeful for 5%, I’ve shed a lot, so I’m hoping that’s a good sign
Spam: i shed a lot at the beginning too
mike29: Lewenberg suck!!! look him up on dejanews
Regrowth: no, they’re two different people
Spam: now i can see places in my scalp that i couldnt before
Spam: dry and wet
cessna: Spam I was in the exact same situation, and I can tell you, no one notices it as much as you
Spam: i just dont know
Spam: i know
Regrowth: spam look at my photos the same thing happened
Spam: but if it continues
Spam: everyone will notice
Mike: has anyone heard of this website he sells proscar for a decent price [email protected]
mike29: spam how long have you been on the treatment?
Spam: im still nor 1
Spam: about 6 months
Spam: but my hair wet….horrible
Spam: dry….i can style it so it looks ok…
cessna: It doesn’t help to hear that, I know. But fretting about it is not helping. You are at a good point in your life to have this affliction, because new things are coming out all the time
mike29: give it a year
Mike: hey regrowth, how does one with diffuse thinning go about rating themselves on a scale.. we dont fit any norwood rating except maybe a little bald spot in the back
Spam: it sux tho….im supposed to be a GOOD candidate
Spam: i got on the treatments when i first noticed my thinning
arbor69: well gotta go soon, hope he is coning
Spam: like a month after
Spam: i just dont know what is going on
Spam: and im frustrated
Regrowth: you can always read the transcript, arbor
cessna: Spam, you probably are. But as my father always tells me: we are of a generation that demands immediate satisfaction, and that just doesn’t happen sometimes. Give it some time and do yourself a favor and try to cut your worrying by 1/2 to start
Mike: yeah that could be part of your problem right there! the stress
Mike: hey Doc
Spam: i just want to have a decent amount of hair throughout college
arbor69: well be sure to ask if these cloning treatments will help those who already are losing their hair
mike29: thats why they don’t sell proscar at McDonalds. Not a fast product
Spam: is that too much to ask?
cessna: I might sound like a jerk saying that but lemme tell you, I know cuz I’ve been there
Tremor: but you don’t stress until you already notice your hair is falling out. so it’s a catch-22 type of thing
arbor69: cloning, whats the scoop
cessna: Tremor: you are right !
Regrowth: Hi Dr. Cooley!
cessna: Greetings Dr. Cooley
Tremor: yup…that’s the rub… :-\
Regrowth: Ok, everybody quiet down.. please direct any questions through me and dont’ ask more than one question until you see your original question asked
cessna: regrowth how do I direct the question through you, I’m new at this
Regrowth: you can send me a private message by typing /tell regrowth message or double clicking on my name in the list or right clicking and choosing to send me a message
Dr. Cooley: Sorry for the delay, folks. I finally made it.
Regrowth: Dr. Cooley, what’s your take on propecia and the minoxidil combo for hairloss?
Dr. Cooley: Any questions?
Dr. Cooley: I think its the best option for early hairloss, no question.
Regrowth: What’s your realistic estimate on a timeframe for hair cloning to be available to the general public?
Dr. Cooley: First alot more research has to be done; in the most optimistic projection I would say five to ten years
Regrowth: What do you think of the latest gene discovery of the ‘hairless’ gene?
Dr. Cooley: Maybe I missed something. There are many, many genes which are necessary for normal hair growth. If you knock one out, you can see hairloss. The fact that a group of people with this defective gene have hairloss does not mean that this gene (or its protein) will help those with the most common form of hairloss (androgenetic alopecia).
Regrowth: What’s your take on products such as Folligen? Helpful or hype when combined with more proven medical treatments?
Dr. Cooley: I think they may be a marginally helpful addition to finasteride and minoxidil; other helpful topicals include retinoic acid and possibly spironolactone.
Regrowth: Have you ever heard anything about propecia potentially causing testicular or breast cancer?
Dr. Cooley: No I haven’t. Have you heard of credible reports that this has occurred?
Regrowth: What do you think of betamethazone valerate for hairloss?
Dr. Cooley: I have had two patients (out of many hundreds) who were using valisone for seborrheic dermatitis and noticed that they seemed to have new hair growth; it was barely noticeable. I would be surprised if it had much growth promoting potential.
arbor69: What is your opinion about transplantation? Can donor hair be obtained by other means other than the back of the head? (synthetic material?)
mkd: Mexicans are not generally prone to baldness. Do they a naturally occuring gene or lack of one?
Dr. Cooley: Hair is only harvested from the back and the sides of the head for most transplants (although I’ve seen a couple reports of using chest and even pubic hair!) Synthetic implants have been disastrous (infection and scarring)
Regrowth: Please direct all questions to me in private and I’ll ask the doctor. I made an exception for arbor because he has to leave.
Regrowth: I’ve also heard of using beard hairs that were removed in a simultaneous face lift
Dr. Cooley: Beard hair can be used to cover scars in other areas like the moustache area.
Regrowth: Do you recommend dr. proctor’s products to your patients?
Dr. Cooley: I recommend finasteride, 5%minoxidil/tretinoin; I tell patients spironolactone and the new copper peptide (trichomin) may help. I assume most people want treatment with a proven track record (known success rate and side effects) and will shy away from expensive products which have not been well studied.
Regrowth: What have you heard about tricomin?
Dr. Cooley: I only know that its in the final stages of clinical study; I understand it should be approved for over the counter use this year. I assume if a company spends the money to take it that far it must work, if only a little.
Regrowth: so it is in phase III studies now or are they going some other way?
Dr. Cooley: I understood it was in phase III studies, but that was secondhand information.
Regrowth: Ahh I have heard some results are supposed to be discussed at the live surgery workshop next month so we’ll see
Regrowth: what sort of results do you see with propecia? Are they similar to what merck’s studies say?
Dr. Cooley: I have about forty patients on it, some for over a year. Most have also been using 5%minoxidil/tretinoin. The majority have been pleased with the results (no hairloss and some regrowth). I spend alot of time counseling patients before starting so they have realistic expectations
Regrowth: What concentration of retin-a do you recommend and can it be used effectively as a cream applied before minoxidil?
Regrowth: Send more questions people 🙂
Dr. Cooley: I prescribed a compound with 0.025% retin-A; the same strength cream would actually be weaker because of less absorbtion in the cream base (also sounds messy)
Regrowth: What sort of complications stand in the way of hair cloning becoming a reality?
Dr. Cooley: There are three main hurdles: 1) is the regenerated hair permanent and does it grow and cycle normally? 2) is it safe or is there any sign of abnormal cellular activity? 3) does the regenerated hair have the same cosmetic characteristics as the original hair?
cessna: tell regrowth Contrary to what Pharmacia&Upjohn says in its literature, is there any benefit to using more than 1ml of 5% minoxidil, even if the area to be treated can not be adequately covered by 1mL? Does the solution diffuse to areas where there is no direct application?
Regrowth: What do you think of spironolactone? is it as effective as propecia and is it safe?
Dr. Cooley: Regarding spironolactone, it definitely blocks the androgen receptor (but not 100%). It may or may not penetrate the necessary 5 millimeters to the hair bulb to have an effect. I would offer it as a complementary treatment to finasteride not a replacement. Just because a medicine works orally does not mean it will work topically
Regrowth: Do you recommend any particular shampoos?
Dr. Cooley: Not really, whatever the patients likes. If they have seborrheic dermatitis, I prescirbe Nizoral shampoo. I don’t think shampoos have any effect on the hairloss process although they may make the hair look better
Regrowth: Have you heard of the mite theory that’s popped up in the last week or two and what do you think of it?
Dr. Cooley: I haven’t heard about it.
Regrowth: oh a researcher announced finding the demodex follicularum mites in balding hair follicles and theorized they might be at least a partial cause of hairloss
Dr. Cooley: Maybe they cause a little bit of extra harmful inflammation that contributes a little to hairloss. Any questions about transplants?
Regrowth: Yes, does anybody have any transplant questions?
Mike: tell regrowth how much do they cost in total on average
Regrowth: there’s your question 🙂
Dr. Cooley: A session may cost $1500 to $4000 (a good investment, given that the hair is permanent)
Regrowth: how many sessions are usually required?
Dr. Cooley: Two or three to cover a given area.
Regrowth: What other doctors do you recommend for people in other areas besides yours? Particularly would you recommend bosley to someone?
mike29: tell regrowth aside from the donor supply (more hair when cloning comes out?). Is there a limit to the density number of transplanted hairs?
Dr. Cooley: It is important to meet with the doctor who will be doing the surgery and determine if their experience, techniques and personality suit you. Regarding the question about density, it usually is not necessary to recrea